Rogue's Turbo'd R27 - 306bhp
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Rogue
Platinum Member
Time for an update.
Things didn't go as smoothly at RST as I intended. I expected to make healthy power in the car, but I had my suspicions after the Wales run that my car didn't feel up to scratch. I'd already had conversations at Paul abut the conversion and he'd already told me what he thought I would needed to make the power I wanted which is far different to what SC Auto's had told me I needed. But I'll tell this story from the beginning.
So when I was considering a conversion I went to SC instead of RST based on a few recommendation. It wasn't anything to do with cost. I'd spoken to Ste and we had a chat about what I wanted and the power I wanted to make and he told me what I'd need and it would be achievable. I purchased the engine from a Renault breaker with the help of SC as he told them what he wanted in terms of ancillaries etc. I'd been told that due to an impending workshop move in about 6 weeks it would been to be a pretty swift conversion - obviously I was happy with this anyway as it meant I got my car back quick. (We know how that plays out though).
I bougt the engine, shipped it straight to SC and arranged for my car to get taken up to Bolton myself.
First couple weeks with SC were good. We were on and off the phone normally once or twice a day. Ste was good at answering any questions or concerns I had and seemed very accommodating. I had made a point of trying to nail down a conversion spec on email and I wanted some form of "contract" but I have to be honest, he didn't seem that willing. Nevertheless, I progressed. The reason I wanted a spec nail down is more do to avoid future problems where we were along the lines of "I should have added this or that whilst the engine was out". Bit like the Forge recirc valve which I got after I had the car back but probably should have known it was better to do whilst the car was out of the engine bay.
As I said, first few weeks moved swiftly.
I'd had a few conversions with Ste at the point saying I'd like the car to be around 350/350. "Shouldn't be a problem" was an all to common phrase I got used too with Ste. As I said, accommodating. Ste told me that It would be beneficial for me to have the hybrid with the larger FMIC. As I didn't get a turbo with the engine I bought, it made sense. - Both of these Ste supplied to me at a cost of £650 each. I had a gearbox laying around which I sent up with the car and it was my decision that I wanted to put a Quaife diff in and for Ste to do the work. Supplied and fitted at £1100. Ste also said I would need an uprated clutch and in the interest of being quick, I agreed and he supplied and fitter that as well, cost of £250.
I remember having a very specific conversation around fueling on this project as I'd been told a couple of times that my setup wouldn't make the 350 I wanted. Again, SC were fine with the questions and I specifically remember me having a chat around needing 630 injectors - categorically told I wouldn't need them. Meg 250 fuels plenty I was told. (This becomes more to the point in the future). I was happy with this, as it was more money I'd obviously not need to pay out and happy that the expert is telling me I don't need to be fueling the car any more than what people on the forum are saying. - I happily continued.
At this point in the juncture, I'd paid SC Auto's a fair chunk of money - all parts were paid for upfront, as you'd expect. There was never any holding back by me, everything was paid on request, on the day.
As we all know, things from about this point where the build neared completion went sour. The car had serious issues making boost and ran very lean. I was told, dangerously so. It had everything replaced from the turbo, to fuel pumps to injectors. For those that know, SC and I had a very public spat about this as I don't think it should have taken 6 months to sort out, he said he had to ship it off to another company to fix, even they couldn't get to the bottom of it properly. (Which apparently SC picked the bill up for). Time dragged on and on and 6 months later I had my car back - turned out to be an incompatible exhaust system. - Again, I had told them I had on the car, they would have known about but didn't check on it. But c'est la vie.
From here on, is where my gripe lays more so.
SC dropped the car off to me and flew back up to Manchester - which was nice of him. I was told the car was being delivered with a basic map which he knew runs well, and it was a 300bhp map. I was happy with that, elated to see the car back after 6 months tbh. The car did come back with a few niggles which I wasn't expecting considering how long he had it.
-The speedo didn't function properly
-The fog lights didn't work
-There was a small coolant leak (Which I only noticed a while after)
- Ste didn't bring down any paperwork which I'd asked for, any of the parts he had removed off the car either. Even though I asked him too
I first noticed the coolant leak a few weeks after having the car back. The header tank was for some reason just dropping off, but there had been some well documented issues with the Forge pipe work.
Around the end of Jan, my alternator failed and I decided to get SC to take the car back, replace the alternator, get the car mapped properly and fix the coolant leak plus sort out the other niggles. The alternator issue was sorted within a few days and he said the coolant leak was fixed as a jubaliee clip had failed. I told him to put a few 100 miles on the car though as it seems to trickle out rather than actually leak and I wanted to make sure it was fixed. In that time, I was also waiting for the car to be mapped. About a month went past and I got bored of waiting tbh, I needed the car back so I arranged to go up to and collect. We had a chat about the mapping whilst I was there and the coolant issue. He hadn't bothered to put any miles on the car as I'd requested as "He doesn't want to drive customers' cars around". Fine - but I didn't have a problem doing it and knowing the nature of the problem, it had been a very specific request. But he said he had fixed the leak. Whilst we were having a conversation about the mapping, I had asked him outright whether he would have a problem with me taking the car else where to get mapped. It'd been about 6 months since he'd been in his new workshop, there wasn't really any signs of a rolling road setup with Ste giving excuses like he can't get people to do the door and had problems with the hole in the floor. None of which I personally believe because it doesn't take 6 months to get a rolling road setup finished. Especially if it's a fundamental part of your business...
I'd had a couple of chats with Motorsport Develpments about the mapping and of course, there was RST. Ste said if I was going to go else where then take the car to MD rather than RST as they would do a better job. (Turns out the MD wanted my car for a WEEK so I didn't bother). As I'd already have a chat with Paul before I went, he said specifically I would need 630 injectors so I asked Ste what I said he said they were uprated ones. Not 630's but due to all the issues of him trying to richen the car up before, he had changed the injectors over and uprated them to make sure the car ran fine. Fair enough.
Anyways, I paid any money I was due to pay (Ste collected the car on a round trip down south when the alternator was knackered) and left.
I poodled down to the nearest Tesco to brim the tank and left. On leaving I noticed a distinct smell of fuel - something that had happened before when Ste dropped the car off in November. We'd been to a petrol station and fueled up and could smell fuel. Tbh, at this point I should have driven back to the garage but I didn't. I went home. It disappeared after a while anyway so I didn't really think anything of it.
Everything was fine until the week after when I went to fuel up again and brimmed the tank. Noticed then fuel running down by my foot. Obviously the instant "****" screams in my head. I phoned my "go to" garage and they were open on the Saturday morning so I popped down. I thought i'd punctured the fuel tank or something...we had a look under the car and could see the fuel leak coming from inside. Matt knew what it was and jumped into the back seat to find that the fuel sending unit was leaking. But more to my dismay, where SC had obviously had to change the fuel pump a few times, instead of dropping the tank to do so, they'd decided to cut a massive flap into the car (Without my permission) to access the fuel sender to change the pump. The decided not to do it up properly so the thing pissed out fuel everytime you brimmed the tank. Obviously I weren't over the moon about this. The excuse I got from SC Auto's was..."Do you want me o keep dropping the tank everytime I need to change your fuel pump" - Well, yes. You don't cut into someones car without asking them prior at bare minimum.
That was about March time. During the same conversation on the phone, I'd again asked about mapping an stressed that I wanted it done before May as I was due to go to the ring. Again, "shouldn't be a problem" was the answer I got.
Due to my impending ring trip, I'd gotten the car MOT'd whilst the car was up with Ste getting the alternator fixed, the track rod ends were highlighted as thing needed changing. I booked the car in to get those done and the seal on the fuel sender unit replaced. TwoTechs also fixed my coolant leak. Properly this time.
May time came and I had dropped SC a couple of emails to ask whether I could get booked in for May 20th for mapping. I'd sent 2 emails in 2 weeks and heard nothing, I'd called but he was "out of the office" so left a message for a return call and got nothing. At this point I couldn't even be arsed so called RST and booked in there. Specifically didn't say anything to anyone about it, waited to see whether I would get a return call from Ste - Never did.
So, May 20th. 1 year and 4 days after my car got collected from my house to go to SC Auto's for a "6 week turnaround" conversion, here I am - Paying out of my own pocket AGAIN, to fix problems. I knew it wasn't going to be a cheap day. I'd been warned about the injectors (But baring in mind I'd been told I had uprated ones already) and the map for a Meg is about £500.
Paul has an overlook on the car, and asks what turbo it is. Which is odd to me. A few months prior, Pauls hybrid ran 350bhp on his Meg. I was a little excited by this as when Ste came to pick up the car in Feb, we'd spoken about it and he told me, word for work, he uses the same hybrid as Paul. Funny, because Paul didn't have a clue what the turbo was...so I had to called SC Autos and Ste (For once) picked up and I asked him.
Anyway, the car is hooked up to the dyno for Paul to do a power run. I told him I've been told I have a standard 300bhp map on the car, but the car felt a little sluggish to me, wasn't sure if it was in my head though.
First run on the dyno: 218bhp. WHAT THE ACTUAL ****. How the hell is that only 218? AND - Paul tells me that it's running massively lean! I'm thinking this is major deja-vu again, but I'm fuming at the so called 300bhp stock map. Paul also tells me that the map is a 2009 stage 2 RST map...which he's obviously pissed about. He says the ignition timing is also way out.
Anyway, a few tweaks, he manages to get the next couple runs up to 235bhp and says it can't get any more. I'm thinking....wtf?? He says the injectors are maxing out...he'd already said to me before hand a while back that the fuel system on the Clio is ****e and unless it was a meg system I was unlikely to hit the power I wanted. He keeps 630s in stock though so we get them changed over. I'm standing over the engine with one of the Pauls guys which he is changing them and he pulls out the injectors only to point out to me that they are stock 250 ones. Hang on a minute...Ste had categorically told me to my face that they'd been uprated. Clearly not.
Car goes back on the dyno and immediately hits 280. Car stays on the dyno for a while longer and after a few more runs hits 317. At this point, Paul is telling me he's unsure with this turbo, but he says the car isn't firing properly and the spark plugs are knackered. Easy fix, but he didn't have any in stock so dials it down to 306.
Surely, if you're doing an engine build for someone, you service the engine and replace the plugs? I'd only had the car back for 7 months, surely they can't be knackered in that time.
I have an indepth chat with Paul around the build and what is actually achievable. He points out a few things which were right.
-Car had the wrong map sensor on it. Needed an R26 one in order to map the car at all. He had to borrow one from another car...I've had to subsequently buy one from Renault (£125).
-The ignition timing was out
-Spark plugs knackered
-Oversized pipes a waste of money. They hit 500bhp on stock pipes.
-Unsure of what turbo it is. Hybrids normally have the turbo housing altered, mine doesn't. He did say the turbo "may be ok" though as it seemed to have more to give.
-Needs an additional fuel system to realistically stand a chance of getting anywhere near 350. Probably like a swirl pot system will be fine.
Obviously by this point I feel devastated. Of all the conversations I'd had with SC Autos over my build, I genuinely feel let down and really disgruntled. It honestly makes me think he didn't have a clue about what he was talking about from the off.
So I had a slow drive home - couldn't boot it because of the wrong map sensor. Car just goes into limp mode. I had a lot of time to contemplate the car, the build, the numerous discussions with both SC and RST.
So, I get home and pump on the laptop and write SC Auto's an email. This was Wednesday evening and gave him until Friday evening to give an acknowledgement. To this point, I've still not had any kind of formal response.
Lets be honest about this...If SC had been upfront from the beginning about what figures I could have actually hit with that setup, I could have made more informed choices. I probably wouldn't have bothered with the hybrid, or the FMIC kit. We could have had a proper discussion around a good fuel setup as well, but I just feel betrayed and misguided by this whole thing.
Not only that, SC's service as at times been appalling. His response to emails at times is non-existent, more so when I approach him with problems. But at other times, he's really on the ball. There was a time a couple months back where I couldn't hit the turbo properly and he was on the end of the phone at 6pm one night helping me find the problem.
So that's where I'm at the the car. I've probably missed bits out of this whole story, but I'm genuinely looking forward to getting rid of the car and putting the whole thing behind me. It's been a hellish YEAR of my life with this build. I'm at a cross roads now where I'm wondering whether to chase SC or not...considering I've just had to spend near £800 at RST to complete a build which he was supposed to do, not including the other bits and bobs like fixing the fuel leak, coolant leak etc.
If he wants to come on here and give his side of the story...fine. But why the **** don't you bother responding to an email first?
After all tat, the car runs a slightly dialled down 306/337. The drive is nice and the power delivery is obviously much better than before. I gained 100bhp on the day, which some would say is a nice difference but I just was so deflated with the day I weren't even that bothered.
Moral of this whole story?
-Do your research
-Talk to a few companies, doesn't matter how may recommendations you get for one
-Build a contract of works to be done, with exact parts
-Plan the build well. Don't forget about the little parts which you may not think of...actuators, recirc valve etc.
-Don't expect it to go smoothly. It probably won't.
Failing that...buy one already done.
Things didn't go as smoothly at RST as I intended. I expected to make healthy power in the car, but I had my suspicions after the Wales run that my car didn't feel up to scratch. I'd already had conversations at Paul abut the conversion and he'd already told me what he thought I would needed to make the power I wanted which is far different to what SC Auto's had told me I needed. But I'll tell this story from the beginning.
So when I was considering a conversion I went to SC instead of RST based on a few recommendation. It wasn't anything to do with cost. I'd spoken to Ste and we had a chat about what I wanted and the power I wanted to make and he told me what I'd need and it would be achievable. I purchased the engine from a Renault breaker with the help of SC as he told them what he wanted in terms of ancillaries etc. I'd been told that due to an impending workshop move in about 6 weeks it would been to be a pretty swift conversion - obviously I was happy with this anyway as it meant I got my car back quick. (We know how that plays out though).
I bougt the engine, shipped it straight to SC and arranged for my car to get taken up to Bolton myself.
First couple weeks with SC were good. We were on and off the phone normally once or twice a day. Ste was good at answering any questions or concerns I had and seemed very accommodating. I had made a point of trying to nail down a conversion spec on email and I wanted some form of "contract" but I have to be honest, he didn't seem that willing. Nevertheless, I progressed. The reason I wanted a spec nail down is more do to avoid future problems where we were along the lines of "I should have added this or that whilst the engine was out". Bit like the Forge recirc valve which I got after I had the car back but probably should have known it was better to do whilst the car was out of the engine bay.
As I said, first few weeks moved swiftly.
I'd had a few conversions with Ste at the point saying I'd like the car to be around 350/350. "Shouldn't be a problem" was an all to common phrase I got used too with Ste. As I said, accommodating. Ste told me that It would be beneficial for me to have the hybrid with the larger FMIC. As I didn't get a turbo with the engine I bought, it made sense. - Both of these Ste supplied to me at a cost of £650 each. I had a gearbox laying around which I sent up with the car and it was my decision that I wanted to put a Quaife diff in and for Ste to do the work. Supplied and fitted at £1100. Ste also said I would need an uprated clutch and in the interest of being quick, I agreed and he supplied and fitter that as well, cost of £250.
I remember having a very specific conversation around fueling on this project as I'd been told a couple of times that my setup wouldn't make the 350 I wanted. Again, SC were fine with the questions and I specifically remember me having a chat around needing 630 injectors - categorically told I wouldn't need them. Meg 250 fuels plenty I was told. (This becomes more to the point in the future). I was happy with this, as it was more money I'd obviously not need to pay out and happy that the expert is telling me I don't need to be fueling the car any more than what people on the forum are saying. - I happily continued.
At this point in the juncture, I'd paid SC Auto's a fair chunk of money - all parts were paid for upfront, as you'd expect. There was never any holding back by me, everything was paid on request, on the day.
As we all know, things from about this point where the build neared completion went sour. The car had serious issues making boost and ran very lean. I was told, dangerously so. It had everything replaced from the turbo, to fuel pumps to injectors. For those that know, SC and I had a very public spat about this as I don't think it should have taken 6 months to sort out, he said he had to ship it off to another company to fix, even they couldn't get to the bottom of it properly. (Which apparently SC picked the bill up for). Time dragged on and on and 6 months later I had my car back - turned out to be an incompatible exhaust system. - Again, I had told them I had on the car, they would have known about but didn't check on it. But c'est la vie.
From here on, is where my gripe lays more so.
SC dropped the car off to me and flew back up to Manchester - which was nice of him. I was told the car was being delivered with a basic map which he knew runs well, and it was a 300bhp map. I was happy with that, elated to see the car back after 6 months tbh. The car did come back with a few niggles which I wasn't expecting considering how long he had it.
-The speedo didn't function properly
-The fog lights didn't work
-There was a small coolant leak (Which I only noticed a while after)
- Ste didn't bring down any paperwork which I'd asked for, any of the parts he had removed off the car either. Even though I asked him too
I first noticed the coolant leak a few weeks after having the car back. The header tank was for some reason just dropping off, but there had been some well documented issues with the Forge pipe work.
Around the end of Jan, my alternator failed and I decided to get SC to take the car back, replace the alternator, get the car mapped properly and fix the coolant leak plus sort out the other niggles. The alternator issue was sorted within a few days and he said the coolant leak was fixed as a jubaliee clip had failed. I told him to put a few 100 miles on the car though as it seems to trickle out rather than actually leak and I wanted to make sure it was fixed. In that time, I was also waiting for the car to be mapped. About a month went past and I got bored of waiting tbh, I needed the car back so I arranged to go up to and collect. We had a chat about the mapping whilst I was there and the coolant issue. He hadn't bothered to put any miles on the car as I'd requested as "He doesn't want to drive customers' cars around". Fine - but I didn't have a problem doing it and knowing the nature of the problem, it had been a very specific request. But he said he had fixed the leak. Whilst we were having a conversation about the mapping, I had asked him outright whether he would have a problem with me taking the car else where to get mapped. It'd been about 6 months since he'd been in his new workshop, there wasn't really any signs of a rolling road setup with Ste giving excuses like he can't get people to do the door and had problems with the hole in the floor. None of which I personally believe because it doesn't take 6 months to get a rolling road setup finished. Especially if it's a fundamental part of your business...
I'd had a couple of chats with Motorsport Develpments about the mapping and of course, there was RST. Ste said if I was going to go else where then take the car to MD rather than RST as they would do a better job. (Turns out the MD wanted my car for a WEEK so I didn't bother). As I'd already have a chat with Paul before I went, he said specifically I would need 630 injectors so I asked Ste what I said he said they were uprated ones. Not 630's but due to all the issues of him trying to richen the car up before, he had changed the injectors over and uprated them to make sure the car ran fine. Fair enough.
Anyways, I paid any money I was due to pay (Ste collected the car on a round trip down south when the alternator was knackered) and left.
I poodled down to the nearest Tesco to brim the tank and left. On leaving I noticed a distinct smell of fuel - something that had happened before when Ste dropped the car off in November. We'd been to a petrol station and fueled up and could smell fuel. Tbh, at this point I should have driven back to the garage but I didn't. I went home. It disappeared after a while anyway so I didn't really think anything of it.
Everything was fine until the week after when I went to fuel up again and brimmed the tank. Noticed then fuel running down by my foot. Obviously the instant "****" screams in my head. I phoned my "go to" garage and they were open on the Saturday morning so I popped down. I thought i'd punctured the fuel tank or something...we had a look under the car and could see the fuel leak coming from inside. Matt knew what it was and jumped into the back seat to find that the fuel sending unit was leaking. But more to my dismay, where SC had obviously had to change the fuel pump a few times, instead of dropping the tank to do so, they'd decided to cut a massive flap into the car (Without my permission) to access the fuel sender to change the pump. The decided not to do it up properly so the thing pissed out fuel everytime you brimmed the tank. Obviously I weren't over the moon about this. The excuse I got from SC Auto's was..."Do you want me o keep dropping the tank everytime I need to change your fuel pump" - Well, yes. You don't cut into someones car without asking them prior at bare minimum.
That was about March time. During the same conversation on the phone, I'd again asked about mapping an stressed that I wanted it done before May as I was due to go to the ring. Again, "shouldn't be a problem" was the answer I got.
Due to my impending ring trip, I'd gotten the car MOT'd whilst the car was up with Ste getting the alternator fixed, the track rod ends were highlighted as thing needed changing. I booked the car in to get those done and the seal on the fuel sender unit replaced. TwoTechs also fixed my coolant leak. Properly this time.
May time came and I had dropped SC a couple of emails to ask whether I could get booked in for May 20th for mapping. I'd sent 2 emails in 2 weeks and heard nothing, I'd called but he was "out of the office" so left a message for a return call and got nothing. At this point I couldn't even be arsed so called RST and booked in there. Specifically didn't say anything to anyone about it, waited to see whether I would get a return call from Ste - Never did.
So, May 20th. 1 year and 4 days after my car got collected from my house to go to SC Auto's for a "6 week turnaround" conversion, here I am - Paying out of my own pocket AGAIN, to fix problems. I knew it wasn't going to be a cheap day. I'd been warned about the injectors (But baring in mind I'd been told I had uprated ones already) and the map for a Meg is about £500.
Paul has an overlook on the car, and asks what turbo it is. Which is odd to me. A few months prior, Pauls hybrid ran 350bhp on his Meg. I was a little excited by this as when Ste came to pick up the car in Feb, we'd spoken about it and he told me, word for work, he uses the same hybrid as Paul. Funny, because Paul didn't have a clue what the turbo was...so I had to called SC Autos and Ste (For once) picked up and I asked him.
Anyway, the car is hooked up to the dyno for Paul to do a power run. I told him I've been told I have a standard 300bhp map on the car, but the car felt a little sluggish to me, wasn't sure if it was in my head though.
First run on the dyno: 218bhp. WHAT THE ACTUAL ****. How the hell is that only 218? AND - Paul tells me that it's running massively lean! I'm thinking this is major deja-vu again, but I'm fuming at the so called 300bhp stock map. Paul also tells me that the map is a 2009 stage 2 RST map...which he's obviously pissed about. He says the ignition timing is also way out.
Anyway, a few tweaks, he manages to get the next couple runs up to 235bhp and says it can't get any more. I'm thinking....wtf?? He says the injectors are maxing out...he'd already said to me before hand a while back that the fuel system on the Clio is ****e and unless it was a meg system I was unlikely to hit the power I wanted. He keeps 630s in stock though so we get them changed over. I'm standing over the engine with one of the Pauls guys which he is changing them and he pulls out the injectors only to point out to me that they are stock 250 ones. Hang on a minute...Ste had categorically told me to my face that they'd been uprated. Clearly not.
Car goes back on the dyno and immediately hits 280. Car stays on the dyno for a while longer and after a few more runs hits 317. At this point, Paul is telling me he's unsure with this turbo, but he says the car isn't firing properly and the spark plugs are knackered. Easy fix, but he didn't have any in stock so dials it down to 306.
Surely, if you're doing an engine build for someone, you service the engine and replace the plugs? I'd only had the car back for 7 months, surely they can't be knackered in that time.
I have an indepth chat with Paul around the build and what is actually achievable. He points out a few things which were right.
-Car had the wrong map sensor on it. Needed an R26 one in order to map the car at all. He had to borrow one from another car...I've had to subsequently buy one from Renault (£125).
-The ignition timing was out
-Spark plugs knackered
-Oversized pipes a waste of money. They hit 500bhp on stock pipes.
-Unsure of what turbo it is. Hybrids normally have the turbo housing altered, mine doesn't. He did say the turbo "may be ok" though as it seemed to have more to give.
-Needs an additional fuel system to realistically stand a chance of getting anywhere near 350. Probably like a swirl pot system will be fine.
Obviously by this point I feel devastated. Of all the conversations I'd had with SC Autos over my build, I genuinely feel let down and really disgruntled. It honestly makes me think he didn't have a clue about what he was talking about from the off.
So I had a slow drive home - couldn't boot it because of the wrong map sensor. Car just goes into limp mode. I had a lot of time to contemplate the car, the build, the numerous discussions with both SC and RST.
So, I get home and pump on the laptop and write SC Auto's an email. This was Wednesday evening and gave him until Friday evening to give an acknowledgement. To this point, I've still not had any kind of formal response.
Lets be honest about this...If SC had been upfront from the beginning about what figures I could have actually hit with that setup, I could have made more informed choices. I probably wouldn't have bothered with the hybrid, or the FMIC kit. We could have had a proper discussion around a good fuel setup as well, but I just feel betrayed and misguided by this whole thing.
Not only that, SC's service as at times been appalling. His response to emails at times is non-existent, more so when I approach him with problems. But at other times, he's really on the ball. There was a time a couple months back where I couldn't hit the turbo properly and he was on the end of the phone at 6pm one night helping me find the problem.
So that's where I'm at the the car. I've probably missed bits out of this whole story, but I'm genuinely looking forward to getting rid of the car and putting the whole thing behind me. It's been a hellish YEAR of my life with this build. I'm at a cross roads now where I'm wondering whether to chase SC or not...considering I've just had to spend near £800 at RST to complete a build which he was supposed to do, not including the other bits and bobs like fixing the fuel leak, coolant leak etc.
If he wants to come on here and give his side of the story...fine. But why the **** don't you bother responding to an email first?
After all tat, the car runs a slightly dialled down 306/337. The drive is nice and the power delivery is obviously much better than before. I gained 100bhp on the day, which some would say is a nice difference but I just was so deflated with the day I weren't even that bothered.
Moral of this whole story?
-Do your research
-Talk to a few companies, doesn't matter how may recommendations you get for one
-Build a contract of works to be done, with exact parts
-Plan the build well. Don't forget about the little parts which you may not think of...actuators, recirc valve etc.
-Don't expect it to go smoothly. It probably won't.
Failing that...buy one already done.
That's bad mate. I would seriously give Trading Standards a ring tbh. Seriously not on you shelling out all that money for basically nothing and if anything your car worse off. He's massively in the wrong here. Take it further for sure.
Pete that's crap buddy I'll stay with stock standard car or just a map see you soon take care [MENTION=3203]Rogue[/MENTION]
.......
worth actually looking doen the legal route? Because if you've clearly been mislead and lied to resulting in you spend alot more time and money then it would be interesting to see where you stand.
Hope you get it all sorted in the end - whatever route you take.
Trophy is always yours for first refusal
worth actually looking doen the legal route? Because if you've clearly been mislead and lied to resulting in you spend alot more time and money then it would be interesting to see where you stand.
Hope you get it all sorted in the end - whatever route you take.
Trophy is always yours for first refusal
TB Rich
Paid Member
Nightmare experience Worse than what I went through, mind a similar conclusion also with spending out extra of your own money taking it to RST to get sorted!
However trying to draw some positives from where you are at presently, it would seem you now have proper injectors, a decent map and I guess when it was pushing the 320bhp mark on the correct MAP sensor, that must be indicative that you were at the limits of the fuel system? Suggesting the engine and turbo etc must all be working correctly?
What did RST say about the whole lean running issue though and with it being put down to the exhaust? Sounds a bit farcical to me, sure an exhaust will restrict a setup but if its mapped correctly then it'll just be down on power but still with a correct AFR. I don't see an excuse there for it being lean...?!
Worse than what I went through, mind a similar conclusion also with spending out extra of your own money taking it to RST to get sorted!However trying to draw some positives from where you are at presently, it would seem you now have proper injectors, a decent map and I guess when it was pushing the 320bhp mark on the correct MAP sensor, that must be indicative that you were at the limits of the fuel system? Suggesting the engine and turbo etc must all be working correctly?
What did RST say about the whole lean running issue though and with it being put down to the exhaust? Sounds a bit farcical to me, sure an exhaust will restrict a setup but if its mapped correctly then it'll just be down on power but still with a correct AFR. I don't see an excuse there for it being lean...?!
Rogue's Turbo'd R27 - 300bhp+
Had no issues with mine Pete, neither did the next owner James, both of us had RR reports at around 306ish bhp as promised.
I know for a fact your car went to ADS in Preston, a diagnostic specialist, if you'd like to call Dave Massey at ADS he will confirm your car went there and SC picked up the bill.
And I'd bare in mind that whilst Paul at RS is pulling your pants down for £800 for a remap he's also in the same sentence slagging off his own map??! If it's his own 2009 stage 2 map then why is the ignition timing out and running lean??
You've got to remember tuners will take any opportunity to slate another tuner.... Maybe not directly , but through customers as above..
I've always found Paul at RS to be full of BS, I've seen some of his files first hand, the hexidecimal is full of Henks signatures, so I doubt very much Paul does any mapping and is infact is just a 'dealer' of Henks
There are always going to be issues in these type of conversions, yours just appeared to have a few more than most, best thing to to is pick up the phone and speak rather than resort to this...
I'm ste's friend but I'm trying to sit on the fence on this one, although you've had you issues you've also had ste drive 200 miles to drop off your car plus numerous late nights, diagnostic cots etc so he has tried
And yes he's tried to get the RR installed but it now requires major and costly foundation work to house the rollers,. Big project to undertake whilst running a business too
To sum up just call him Pete, you'll get things sorted
Had no issues with mine Pete, neither did the next owner James, both of us had RR reports at around 306ish bhp as promised.
I know for a fact your car went to ADS in Preston, a diagnostic specialist, if you'd like to call Dave Massey at ADS he will confirm your car went there and SC picked up the bill.
And I'd bare in mind that whilst Paul at RS is pulling your pants down for £800 for a remap he's also in the same sentence slagging off his own map??! If it's his own 2009 stage 2 map then why is the ignition timing out and running lean??
You've got to remember tuners will take any opportunity to slate another tuner.... Maybe not directly , but through customers as above..
I've always found Paul at RS to be full of BS, I've seen some of his files first hand, the hexidecimal is full of Henks signatures, so I doubt very much Paul does any mapping and is infact is just a 'dealer' of Henks
There are always going to be issues in these type of conversions, yours just appeared to have a few more than most, best thing to to is pick up the phone and speak rather than resort to this...
I'm ste's friend but I'm trying to sit on the fence on this one, although you've had you issues you've also had ste drive 200 miles to drop off your car plus numerous late nights, diagnostic cots etc so he has tried
And yes he's tried to get the RR installed but it now requires major and costly foundation work to house the rollers,. Big project to undertake whilst running a business too
To sum up just call him Pete, you'll get things sorted
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Rogue
Platinum Member
I know you two are mates, and that's fine. There's always 2 sides to every story, most of what's gone on only myself and him will know about. But that's just how it is.
Rogue
Platinum Member
Nightmare indeed.
Nightmare experience
However trying to draw some positives from where you are at presently, it would seem you now have proper injectors, a decent map and I guess when it was pushing the 320bhp mark on the correct MAP sensor, that must be indicative that you were at the limits of the fuel system? Suggesting the engine and turbo etc must all be working correctly? Yeah - exactly that. I need a swirl pot system or something similar to do it properly and fuel the car. We're unsure of the turbo still, but basically fueling would definitely be next steps.
What did RST say about the whole lean running issue though and with it being put down to the exhaust? Sounds a bit farcical to me, sure an exhaust will restrict a setup but if its mapped correctly then it'll just be down on power but still with a correct AFR. I don't see an excuse there for it being lean...?!He didn't say anything to be fair. Don't forget, prior to me going to RST this car hadn't been mapped from build. It was just loaded with a workable map which was supposedly running fine. Ste never wanted to give the car back whilst it was running lean, as soon as we stuck a Miltek on it, apparently the car ran fine. Obviously i'm only guided by what I'm being told, but RST told me it were still lean. Didn't say how lean, but still lean.
Rogue's Turbo'd R27 - 300bhp+
Well I hope you can get it sorted Pete, when I was building mine I was looking for circa 300bhp, and that's what I got, I tried 360cc injectors but went back to the 250 injectors as the car cold started and ran better.
Like I said, I think you've just had a lot of bad luck, but Ste is a reasonable guy, sure you two can sort it.
He is always very busy, but when it comes to it he'll sort it out - trust me!
I'm not sure on the fuel side of things as I never went that far, not sure if a bigger in tank pump, swirl pot & injectors are needed as shakey did?
Uncharted territory as far as I know? I think Wilson was doing some research
Any way I hope you can get things resolved
Well I hope you can get it sorted Pete, when I was building mine I was looking for circa 300bhp, and that's what I got, I tried 360cc injectors but went back to the 250 injectors as the car cold started and ran better.
Like I said, I think you've just had a lot of bad luck, but Ste is a reasonable guy, sure you two can sort it.
He is always very busy, but when it comes to it he'll sort it out - trust me!
I'm not sure on the fuel side of things as I never went that far, not sure if a bigger in tank pump, swirl pot & injectors are needed as shakey did?
Uncharted territory as far as I know? I think Wilson was doing some research
Any way I hope you can get things resolved
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