Smug git.

[truck.driver147]

Probably going to sound like a smug git but here goes.

What's with people saying the 197s are slow? After owning a WRX pushing 280 bhp my 197 actually feels faster, more fun, way better handling and just generally puts a smile on my face.

Why Meg them? So many threads with problems. And surely your just wrecking the handling anyway with sticking that lump up front? So suspension changes maybe? And maybe buy a Megane in the first place.

Mines on 76k and no crunches from the gearbox. Just luck? (Makes a change). Or do we not hear from successful owners?

And yes I'm 43 and probably going through a mid life crisis. I call it being enthusiastic about cars hahaha.

Hope I'm not ranting just have to say it's probably the best car I've owned.

 

[Chris]

Dont think anyone sais they're slow, they are just lacking a bit of oomph in the straights, nobody can deny their conerning ability.

When you meg them, your taking one lump out and putting another in, theres probaly not a great deal of weight difference, a little more with the turbo maybe, granted. From what ive seen most people who meg them also upgrade to coilovers and bigger brakes.

A megane is also a bigger car, so whilst ive not been in a megged clio I imagine they are quite a machine. Whatever car you get, you can almost guarantee there is someone wanting to go faster in one somewhere else.

 

[Rogue]

Because they are slow. In a straight line you'll struggle to beat a Micra to a qtr mile.

In all seriousness, I think it's a placebo effect with the Clio, because you're revving the nuts off it, you think you're going fast. In reality, not really. They're semi quick, but definitely no quicker than a lot of other hot hatches.

Why meg it? Best of both worlds. Doesn't ruin the handling (Although I'm yet to put that to full testament around a track), you surprise most things on the road and for me, it's nicer to drive. I'm averaging 37mpg at the moment, it's nice to cruise on a motorway because it's quiet but I know if I want to, I don't even have to down shift to pull away from most other hot hatches I just plant my foot down in 6th and I'm off.

Why not buy a Megane? If you have a Clio, a conversion is cheaper. You can get low end 5 year old Meg cups for about 10-12 but FF's with Cup Chassis seem to be higher value at the moment. Tbh, I would have gotten a Meg, but couldn't find one I wanted. So I decided to have fun with mine. Regret it? Maybe, at times. I'll tell you what though, ask any person who's been in my car (Apart from my Mrs) and ask them how much they grin from ear to ear when I show them what 300brake in a Clio is like.

I think it's horses for courses though. It all depends on what you want and are expecting from the Clio. IMO, it looks good, drives average at best. But you're not buying it for a motorway cruiser, you're buying it because you know how good the chassis is. As long as you're within the realms of knowing that it's French and it'll probably cost you a fortune to fix at some point, it's all good.

 

[montana]

After doing quite a bit of research into the 197 before buying i also got the impression from the 'Internet' that they were slow(er), worse on fuel and didnt handle as well compared to their old 1*2 counterparts - so far since owning one, i have found them to be quite the opposite. Thats the trouble with internet opinion - needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

[nutnutwelshman]

I had a ff200 on the right roads not much will get away from you they are fantastic cars

 

[CallorFold]

Coming from a 100 bhp, heavier car, the Clio feels like a rocket ship.

However, my brother has an Astra VXR, and in a straight line, that feels PROPERLY quick by comparison. Obviously it's bigger engine, turbo, more power, but it really throws you back into the seat and the tyres squeal when you bury the throttle. Not sure how they'd compare through the twistys though, never really put them head-head.

 

[gemma.l]

Coming from a 100 bhp, heavier car, the Clio feels like a rocket ship.

However, my brother has an Astra VXR, and in a straight line, that feels PROPERLY quick by comparison. Obviously it's bigger engine, turbo, more power, but it really throws you back into the seat and the tyres squeal when you bury the throttle. Not sure how they'd compare through the twistys though, never really put them head-head.

Me and the fella put my clio head to head with his VXR ended up with me in tears lol. I knew I couldn't bet him anyway but was worth a try.

 

[antnee]

The public have fallen in love with modern turbo engines, which are very easy to drive and easy to drive quickly.

I like the fact you have to wait to 5k till you hit the main power band, it means you have to think about when you use the power. You can't just squirt it at any given time, that does bring about it's own issues at times. In a willy waving society of social media it is much easier to say I have xxx bhp and raced/beat this much more expensive car in a traffic light GP than it is to say I had some fun on the back lanes which another enthusiast, gave him the thumbs up and we went on our own ways.

In a way, converting the 197/200 is a little bit sad, it is one of the last proper hot hatches, were a manufacturer chucks a good, high revving engine in which is focused on the performance and rewards you the harder you push it. Not an engine that has it's eyes on MPG and how the wider audience embraces the car.

 

[gemma.l]

That is true [MENTION=52344]antnee[/MENTION]. But turbo’s give you a feeling that you cannot get from a naturally aspirated car. I drive all the fella's turbo’s and I can say they are so much fun as there is no waiting for the power to kick in it is instant plus they are easily tunable which makes them more desirable. But at the end of the day I would always choose my 197 over a turbo.

 

[MikeO]

B...
In all seriousness, I think it's a placebo effect with the Clio, because you're revving the nuts off it, you think you're going fast. In reality, not really. They're semi quick, but definitely no quicker than a lot of other hot hatches.
...

Not knocking the earlier Clio's, they are GREAT motors. But tend to agree with this comment really. Rather like my previous car (or one of them at least) the new Suzuki Swift sport. Great little motor, felt like you were really shifting (peak power 6.9k I seem to remember) that is until you got someone up your backside in something not that impressive and WTF ... they could keep up... until a decent series of corners turns up and then the car really came into it's own element. Though obviously the previous gen RS Clio's are a wee bit quicker than the Swift sport... but you get the idea.

It used to make me smile that some of the guys on the Swift forums seemed to think their cars in stock trim could crack 7 seconds to 60. In your dreams boyz.

Though as some others have commented, in some respects a decent turbo charged engine is just way too easy to extract the power from and in some ways I do think you loose a bit of the drama here. Only my personal onion obviously

 

[Foxspeed]

Probably going to sound like a smug git but here goes.

What's with people saying the 197s are slow? After owning a WRX pushing 280 bhp my 197 actually feels faster, more fun, way better handling and just generally puts a smile on my face.

Why Meg them? So many threads with problems. And surely your just wrecking the handling anyway with sticking that lump up front? So suspension changes maybe? And maybe buy a Megane in the first place.

Mines on 76k and no crunches from the gearbox. Just luck? (Makes a change). Or do we not hear from successful owners?

And yes I'm 43 and probably going through a mid life crisis. I call it being enthusiastic about cars hahaha.

Hope I'm not ranting just have to say it's probably the best car I've owned.

this will wake a few up :lol2:

 

[Stevoox]

Because they are slow. In a straight line you'll struggle to beat a Micra to a qtr mile.

In all seriousness, I think it's a placebo effect with the Clio, because you're revving the nuts off it, you think you're going fast. In reality, not really. They're semi quick, but definitely no quicker than a lot of other hot hatches.

Why meg it? Best of both worlds. Doesn't ruin the handling (Although I'm yet to put that to full testament around a track), you surprise most things on the road and for me, it's nicer to drive. I'm averaging 37mpg at the moment, it's nice to cruise on a motorway because it's quiet but I know if I want to, I don't even have to down shift to pull away from most other hot hatches I just plant my foot down in 6th and I'm off.

Why not buy a Megane? If you have a Clio, a conversion is cheaper. You can get low end 5 year old Meg cups for about 10-12 but FF's with Cup Chassis seem to be higher value at the moment. Tbh, I would have gotten a Meg, but couldn't find one I wanted. So I decided to have fun with mine. Regret it? Maybe, at times. I'll tell you what though, ask any person who's been in my car (Apart from my Mrs) and ask them how much they grin from ear to ear when I show them what 300brake in a Clio is like.

I think it's horses for courses though. It all depends on what you want and are expecting from the Clio. IMO, it looks good, drives average at best. But you're not buying it for a motorway cruiser, you're buying it because you know how good the chassis is. As long as you're within the realms of knowing that it's French and it'll probably cost you a fortune to fix at some point, it's all good.

Nail on the head.

The clio is a quick car, fast in the corners but in a dead straight line you can feel it starts to lack. Put your foot down in 6th when doing 70 and you don't really go very far. If I do the same in the meg then easily over 100

I was thinking of a meg conversion when i had my 200 but went against it as I didn't want all the hassle. I then started looking for a meg as its then best of both worlds, all the handling etc of the clio, but a ton more power. Always wanted a Trophy, a perfect example came up and here I am. It also has the rarity factor too.

If I had to get rid of the Meg would I buy a clio again - no. A clio with a meg engine - yes.

Edit: Just to add, Pete's car (Rogue) is pretty dam good. I write the last sentence due to a passenger ride in it

 

[Raptor6767]

I love my 197 now.

It's fast in the straight line, and even faster in the corners.

 

[Stephenvenning]

The public have fallen in love with modern turbo engines, which are very easy to drive and easy to drive quickly.

I like the fact you have to wait to 5k till you hit the main power band, it means you have to think about when you use the power. You can't just squirt it at any given time, that does bring about it's own issues at times. In a willy waving society of social media it is much easier to say I have xxx bhp and raced/beat this much more expensive car in a traffic light GP than it is to say I had some fun on the back lanes which another enthusiast, gave him the thumbs up and we went on our own ways.

In a way, converting the 197/200 is a little bit sad, it is one of the last proper hot hatches, were a manufacturer chucks a good, high revving engine in which is focused on the performance and rewards you the harder you push it. Not an engine that has it's eyes on MPG and how the wider audience embraces the car.

I see what you mean about the NA age is over and that you are going against what the clio is about. But I'm sorry the f4R is far from 'good', it's a rubbish NA engine IMO just look at the people that have spent thousands on the engine to keep it NA and it's got them 10hp :lol: if I wanted a dedicated NA I'd go for an ep3 or dc5. I'm looking forward until I complete my meg'd clio.

 

[Raptor6767]

I see what you mean about the NA age is over and that you are going against what the clio is about. But I'm sorry the f4R is far from 'good', it's a rubbish NA engine IMO just look at the people that have spent thousands on the engine to keep it NA and it's got them 10hp :lol: if I wanted a dedicated NA I'd go for an ep3 or dc5. I'm looking forward until I complete my meg'd clio.

[video]https://youtu.be/3BzCQI8ln1Y[/video]

[video]https://youtu.be/5ZNl8p5i53Q[/video]

[video]https://youtu.be/8EIOzqDoB_8[/video]

~3k€ under the bonnet.

 

[Stephenvenning]

I understand your point mate but a ep3 with 3k would be even better. I'm not having ago, I absolutely love your clio and it's nice people like you are pushing the boundaries of what these cars can do, but just think like everything these days turbos solve a lot of problems like fuel and lack of torque.

 

[Raptor6767]

I'm always up for a turbo. If I was to do it all again I would Meg the Clio...but once you start pumping € in the project...it's hard to quit.

Results are here...I have a couple of other mods I want to do and if that is not fast enough - forced induction is the only way (I might get a SC at a reasonable price so it might go that way).

No turbo, no fun.

 

[antnee]

I see what you mean about the NA age is over and that you are going against what the clio is about. But I'm sorry the f4R is far from 'good', it's a rubbish NA engine IMO just look at the people that have spent thousands on the engine to keep it NA and it's got them 10hp :lol: if I wanted a dedicated NA I'd go for an ep3 or dc5. I'm looking forward until I complete my meg'd clio.

What determines the F4R as 'rubbish' though? 100bhp/litre and a 7.5k redline are pretty good. Sure you can buy a Honda engine which has a bit more power as standard and there are cheaper upgrades but there are more markets which can develop the Honda engine. How many F4R tuners are there in Japan and the USA? By the same reasoning you could say the Meg engine is rubbish as you can get 360bhp+ from a VAG 2.0 on a standard turbo and internals....

I had a Mk2 Ibiza, with a 2.0 16v engine in. You could get it to around 210bhp with a set or lairy cams, head work, ITBs and standalone management which would set you back a good few grand. How ever that wasn't a rubbish engine. I could match a cammed Clio 182 Trophy on a track driven by 2 very competent drivers.

I don't think the engine is the issue in the 197/200, it is the weight, 100kg more than the Fiesta ST (2.0), Mini CS and Corsa VXR. Loose that 100kg and you gain almost 15bhp/ton.

 

[Yiannis197]

The f4r is not rubbish, not at all and I agree with antnee.

It is not tunable I give you that but far from being rubbish. It is as reliable as it gets as opposed to K20, it will output 100bhp/lt if broken in properly, it has more torque than the K20 and it passes the euro 5 emissions even if it's a high rev 2.0 lt engine...

As I said, far from rubbish

 

[skiptontweed]

You could stick another 100bhp in the clio and still want more power, it's all relative. On track my Clio 200 only ever seems slow when I'm trying to outdrag something slightly faster in a straight line. If it had more power, I'd just struggle to outdrag something else, and then it would feel slow again.
I was thinking about power upgrades myself (cams & itb's) but came to the conclusion I'm better buying something significantly quicker to start with, but then I'm in to M3 or Caterham territory and it all gets a bit expensive.