I need more cold air!

[ScoobyWhite]

Hi

Can you share what you do / what you change?
I was measuring and the inlet intake temp is always above 30ºc....

How can we drop this?
I think this will be a nice Thread for everyone!


Thanks

 

[Chrisgti6]

Not really necessary as far as I'm aware. The intake on the 197/200 is very good in standard form.

30 degrees is hardly high tbh.

 

[shotgunsjay]

Air vent in the bonnet? A lad on here had one put on his 197 looked smart and made an improvement to induction

 

[ScoobyWhite]

Hi

I have a V6 airbox. I in a day that the out side temp is 15, the minimal intake temp was 29~30 running on road/highway...

I am after intake temps of 22....


Thanks

 

[Chrisgti6]

That's likely to achieve less than a 1% power increase, what's the point?

 

[ScoobyWhite]

1%??

If you make some calculations if you drop 10 to 12ºC in the intake temp you will gain a lot more that 1% of power....

 

[Matt W]

What's the point? Seriously?

Just sounds like you're unhappy with the car.

 

[ScoobyWhite]

My car run 208hp and 231nm in a rolling road with 42+ intel temp

I see that in away with outside temp of 15ºC I ran 30º~32ºC inlet temp, but I am after to low it a little more so I can get just a little more power....
I am searching 10hp! I think the car have possibility of doing it

I am searching for help/opinions so we all can achieve better results!

Anyone try a hose near the headlight so we can route it to the inlet airbox?


Thanks

 

[sam-r27]

My car run 208hp and 231nm in a rolling road with 42+ intel temp

I see that in away with outside temp of 15ºC I ran 30º~32ºC inlet temp, but I am after to low it a little more so I can get just a little more power....
I am searching 10hp! I think the car have possibility of doing it

I am searching for help/opinions so we all can achieve better results!

Anyone try a hose near the headlight so we can route it to the inlet airbox?


Thanks

10bhp will take a lot of searching for.............

 

[GrumpyTwig]

Inlet temps sorted??



Simple

On a more sensible note this would be a sensible solution without looking too fast and furious:

 

[ScoobyWhite]

My v6 airbox inlet is quite near the rear of the front headlight so the bonnet change propose will not fit my case

I would like to know if anyone that costume made a inlet duct have seen Power intake temp with is mods?


Thanks

 

[frediiii]

That's likely to achieve less than a 1% power increase, what's the point?

get your facts straight... air has a density of 1.204 kg/m³ at 20°c. at 30°c it drops to 1.644 kg/m³. thats 3.3% less air that can be mixed with fuel. so you loose up to 6.5 bhp at peak power. and thats almost linear. so if ambient temp is 20°c and your intake air 50°c, you are almost 20bhp down on power...

i dealt with that a lot with my twingo 133 where during summer the inlet temps reached 50-75°c. but without swapping the big chunk of alloy of a plenum that acts like a hairdryer to one made of plastic or carbon fiber, you can only delay the process of heating up by using ptfe gaskets...

 

[Foxspeed]

get your facts straight... air has a density of 1.204 kg/m³ at 20°c. at 30°c it drops to 1.644 kg/m³. thats 3.3% less air that can be mixed with fuel. so you loose up to 6.5 bhp at peak power. and thats almost linear. so if ambient temp is 20°c and your intake air 50°c, you are almost 20bhp down on power...

i dealt with that a lot with my twingo 133 where during summer the inlet temps reached 50-75°c. but without swapping the big chunk of alloy of a plenum that acts like a hairdryer to one made of plastic or carbon fiber, you can only delay the process of heating up by using ptfe gaskets...

arent those figures wrong? density? 1.2kg is less than 1.6kg so in the same volume so in effect more of it ie air?

as for ptfe gasket cannot see the benefit of somethng like that when under the bonnet and bolted to the head - it will still heat up due to heat soak and the studs tranfering the heat etc...

 

[Chrisgti6]

All I will say is good luck chasing 20bhp via intake temps alone! lol

Maybe on a high power turbo'd car, but on a <200bhp N/A engine - No chance.

 

[frediiii]

arent those figures wrong? density? 1.2kg is less than 1.6kg so in the same volume so in effect more of it ie air?

Sorry, wrote that with the cell whilst sitting on the can the 1.644 should read 1.1644, which is less dense.

as for ptfe gasket cannot see the benefit of somethng like that when under the bonnet and bolted to the head - it will still heat up due to heat soak and the studs tranfering the heat etc...

I partly agree. As I said, it will only slow down the heat soaking process. But this also allows the intake air to cool down the manifold faster, due to less heat being transported to the plenum whilst retaining the same amount of cold intake air flowing through the assembly.

All I will say is good luck chasing 20bhp via intake temps alone! lol

go ahead and read my post again. 20bhp would apply at a intake air reduction of 30°C, which is not realistic to achieve, unless you have a good connection to a liquid nitrogen supplier or wrap the manifold in aerogel a permanent decrease of 10°C however should be achievable using proper thermal insulation like ptfe gaskets and ceramic coating. but is it worth the trouble? probably not

 

[henderson]

i use a neoprene hose from the lower front grille to feed my airbox,i feel it makes a decent differece at speed but nothing like the figures your talkimg mate,anyway here's a pic


plenum temps by scott1532, on Flickr

you can just see where it comes out and feed the filter in this shot,


maxogen setup by scott1532, on Flickr

 

[frediiii]

it makes a decent differece at speed but nothing like the figures your talkimg mate

maybe you should try pointing the cold air feed to the manifold then we are talking about inlet air temperature. your setup replicates the stock setup (fetches cold air from the front using equal pipe length and also some warmer air from the bay like the stock sound valve thingy because the hose is not connected to the filter directly) and therefore makes no difference.

bringing cold air to the plenum is good effort, but with it being 30°C warmer than ambient temperature, it heats up the air flowing threw it like a hairdryer...

 

[henderson]

like this then you mean,the large neoprene hose is fed from the upper front grille and uses the old position of the stock feed


plenum temps by scott1532, on Flickr


plenum temps by scott1532, on Flickr


plenum temps by scott1532, on Flickr

 

[frediiii]

you do like your hoses, don't you?

actually, that is a good idea and should help cooling down the plenum and therefore the inlet temp when running at higher speeds. did you ever bother measuring if it makes any difference? I had a scangauge connected to my twingo all the time and was constantly monitoring the inlet air temp.

would be interesting if there is any measurable difference in real life with your setup vs stock (or at least with covered airfeed pipe)

 

[ScoobyWhite]

Thank you very much to you all for the help and photos...

I will add some hose and the inlet pipe that henderson has show!

I am after 8~10hp (no one talk in 20hp) to get that figure that we think that I should achieve so I need a drop more or less of 10ºC so I think is possible of doing it, and if we all help each other with ideas/tests we probably will find good results for all!


Thanks