Bleeding ABS - HELP :')

[Brunoandrade98]

Hi all,

On the weekend, I fitted brand new rear calipers from TRW and bled all 4 brake calipers.

After testing the car, I found that the brake pedal feel was a lot more mushy/spongy and braking performance wasn't as sharp as before.
Just overall less responsive brakes.

I bled them myself with a Sealey pressure bleeder, and then one final time without it, with a second person pressing the brakes.
Since then, I also tried gravity bleeding them, to no avail. By the time I closed each bleed screw, only clean fluid was coming out, with no air bubbles.

I made sure both rear brake lines were only exposed to air for a few seconds, so I know there couldn't be much air in there since there were only a few drops of brake fluid coming out of them.

I tried hooking up my CAN CLiP to do an ABS bleed, but I don't even get the options listed in the procedure in the attached pictures, just like I get when bleeding the ABS of a Twingo I own.

Essentially, I'm stuck with bad brakes and no way to get them right.

Any ideas or any help will be much appreciated

 

[LiamP]

Fairly sure the procedure is detailing the commands for Clio II, which are equivalent to what you see on Clip but with a different ID.

ie. AC004 == AC154

 

[R20BTG]

^ This

The codes are different but the procedure is the same. The procedure isn't intuitive to find (none of CLiP is, I find) but I stumbled across it eventually. Keep clicking around the different menus until you find it. I don't have my car laptop with me at the moment so I can't tell you where to find it, but I did come across eventually and successfully - see post HERE

It's a 2-person job though, someone needs to sit in the car with the laptop and mash the pedal while someone goes round the calipers opening/closing the bleed nipples.

 

[Brunoandrade98]

^ This

The codes are different but the procedure is the same. The procedure isn't intuitive to find (none of CLiP is, I find) but I stumbled across it eventually. Keep clicking around the different menus until you find it. I don't have my car laptop with me at the moment so I can't tell you where to find it, but I did come across eventually and successfully - see post HERE

It's a 2-person job though, someone needs to sit in the car with the laptop and mash the pedal while someone goes round the calipers opening/closing the bleed nipples.

This is really helpful! Can I ask, however...what is the exact procedure? I've been trying to do the same job on a Twingo without any success for a while now.

I'm going to say how I do it, and if you could tell me where I'm going wrong, I'd greatly appreciate it.

1. Bleed all brakes as normal in the following order: Rear Right -> Rear Left -> Front Left - Front Right;
2. Connect CLIP;
3. Connect Pressure Bleeder to the master cylinder reservoir and give it some pressure;
4. Open Rear Right bleed valve;
5. Activate the solenoid valve for the specific wheel in CLIP, which will cause the ABS pump to run;
6. Press the brake about 1/3 of the way while I hear the pump running;
7. Once the command finishes, I release the brake pedal;
8. Close the bleed valve;
9. Repeat for the other wheels;

Also, my pressure bleeder broke...Is there any chance I can do this procedure without it? If so, how exactly?

Really appreciate the help

 

[R20BTG]

Once you've found the correct program in CLiP it will give step-by-step instructions on which corner to start with, when to open the valves, when to press on the pedal etc. You don't need a list in advance you just need to follow the program and do what it says on the screen. Once you do each corner you need to click to confirm to move onto the next one, so don't feel like you're rushed.

You will not need a pressure bleeding kit. You will need to periodically check the brake fluid reservoir to make sure you've got enough in there. The last thing you want is to suck air in through the master cylinder by letting the reservoir run low.

When going through the program you will need to put a lot of pressure into the brake pedal, so you'll need to be sitting in the car pumping the brakes when it tells you. I can't see how this is anything other than a two person job having done it myself. As the air escapes the sound of the ABS pump will change slightly and you'll get a much better pedal feel.

 

[Brunoandrade98]

Once you've found the correct program in CLiP it will give step-by-step instructions on which corner to start with, when to open the valves, when to press on the pedal etc. You don't need a list in advance you just need to follow the program and do what it says on the screen. Once you do each corner you need to click to confirm to move onto the next one, so don't feel like you're rushed.

You will not need a pressure bleeding kit. You will need to periodically check the brake fluid reservoir to make sure you've got enough in there. The last thing you want is to suck air in through the master cylinder by letting the reservoir run low.

When going through the program you will need to put a lot of pressure into the brake pedal, so you'll need to be sitting in the car pumping the brakes when it tells you. I can't see how this is anything other than a two person job having done it myself. As the air escapes the sound of the ABS pump will change slightly and you'll get a much better pedal feel.

I did notice the Rear Left Hand makes quite a bit of noise from the front of the car when ejecting fluid from the brake bleed valve. Probably has air in the ABS module, which lines up with my suspicions.

When you say pump the brakes, do you mean leaving the pedal pressed or pressing it a few times during the procedure? Just so I'm clear that I'm not wasting time doing it the wrong way.

 

[R20BTG]

You'll need to stand on the pedal hard and push it all the way to the floor over a few seconds while the pump does its thing. From memory you do it several times per corner.

 

[LiamP]

1. Bleed all brakes as normal in the following order: Rear Right -> Rear Left -> Front Left - Front Right;
2. Connect CLIP;
3. Connect Pressure Bleeder to the master cylinder reservoir and give it some pressure;
4. Open Rear Right bleed valve;
5. Activate the solenoid valve for the specific wheel in CLIP, which will cause the ABS pump to run;
6. Press the brake about 1/3 of the way while I hear the pump running;
7. Once the command finishes, I release the brake pedal;
8. Close the bleed valve;
9. Repeat for the other wheels;

You want to do 8 before 7, ie. the system is under pressure when you close the valves.

 

[Brunoandrade98]

You'll need to stand on the pedal hard and push it all the way to the floor over a few seconds while the pump does its thing. From memory you do it several times per corner.

Define "several times". I was home an hour ago and did the procedure at good 15 times per rear corner, and the brake pedal feel didn't change a bit

 

[R20BTG]

Have you found the routine in CLiP?

 

[Frank Perry]

This is crazy - I've bled my brakes so many times with the sealey pressure bleeder kit without an issue... I've changed front and rear callipers at different intervals and re-bled, installed braded lines and re-bled, removed fronts to get the shitty pins out and replace for mr pinks which required another re-bleed... I also had a fuel pump failure which mean the fuel tank had to come out which requires disconnecting the rear brake lines & had to re-bleed again. The pressure bleeder has never 'not worked'...

It's also worth noting, I have an RSTuner (from fastchip.nl) and I paid for the ABS module which allows you to electronically bleed the brakes. No idea if it's the same as what CLiP does, but you select a corner, smack the "bleed" button and it makes some funky noises.. Pic below;


Whether this has had an effect, I don't know...

Am I right in saying the clutch is part of this system also? I've never messed about with bleeding the clutch line, or perhaps you have a small leak somewhere? Or as you have suggested, air in the system trapped somewhere?

 

[R20BTG]

The reason I had to use it was because I replaced the ABS pump