The Clio of Epic Sluggishness.

[NickD]

It is rare for me to post or even create a progress thread as I have done all that sort of stuff years ago with Mazda's and it has basically all been done.


However, my Storm Grey 200, which bought in 2017 for £2,500 and love driving needed some love. It might have only cost that much, it had 178,000 miles on it at the time and I was told it had probably been clocked, but one lady owner. I am not even going to attempt to add up the money I have spent since, it would scare me.
I called it the Clio of Epic Sluggishness, because, basically it was. I had a shoot out at Donington with Chris Hoey's 208 Gti (Circuit Days) and Robert Harrison's Integra (Track Time) and was destroyed in a straight line by what should have been similar power cars. It always felt like it was in too high a gear and had no urge. When it got to a dyno, RS Tuning, it made 182 bhp.
However in March it went to Jade Developments for some goodies. I wanted a diff, and although the original gearbox was still sweet, that got some new bits, as well as suspension and things. It then went to the body shop to have the massive dent taken out of the side where I was told the previous owners son had been kicking it. Not sure that is the case, but very big up to Darren at Greens Total Car Care in Birmingham for a very excellent job.


And then to Capital Seating in Leicester for sorting the seats. It is never going to be a show car.
Finally then to Engine Dynamics, where I am sitting here typing this.
The reason it could not come to the track day at Snetterton in August was it had an issue diagnosed as the cat being blocked.


Not quite true but similar. Anyway another wheelbarrow full of money to K Tech for their finest exhaust manifold and sports cat. And we are now back there. The engine has cams, and is now looking like 195 bhp. However, by bypassing the standard air box, it has made another 11bhp!!! So 206bhp! I know dyno figures vary, but the change between one condition and another is what it is about and when all put together that is over 26bhp up on what it went in with this morning. Guess who has just sent another wedge of cash to K Tech for an induction kit?
Feeling quite pleased!

 

[Big Ben]

Can imagine you enjoyed listening to radio 2 sat in his waiting room?!

Good news on the car though Nick. Hopefully catch you on another track day soon

 

[J90RDN]

Interesting that the stock intake was restricting as much as 11bhp. Normally a stock intake with a performance panel filter gives much better results than an induction cone, especially a cone without any heat shielding (I seem to remember the KTEC one has shielding though). I have the R3 intake and it might be placebo, but it seems to make a difference top end, although mid-range is still pants.

 

[NickD]

Can imagine you enjoyed listening to radio 2 sat in his waiting room?!

Good news on the car though Nick. Hopefully catch you on another track day soon

All my vehicles are set to Radio 2, it was perfect!

 

[Helpimonfire]

Even if the Ktec intake makes no extra power, it does add a nice noise so that was enough for me.

Nice to see you post a thread though Nick, I knew you owned one but didn't realise it was a moon miles SG. Hands down my favourite colour, I'm tempted to get mine wrapped in a similar colour (not only because I like the colour but also to keep cabin temps bearable during trackdays!)

 

[Onrus]

Good results. What cams are you running?

 

[NickD]

Good results. What cams are you running?

These are the 405 cams, but not just a case of bolting them in. It is the follower and hydraulic lifter kit as well. Plus a K Tech inlet, exhaust and cat, with Miltek from the cat back.

 

[Onrus]

And that’s been mapped on the stock ecu?

 

[NickD]

As far

And that’s been mapped on the stock ecu?

As far as I know, yes.

 

[NickD]

I thought I had posted this up already, but can't see it.

 

[Onrus]

405 is a wild cam. How does the car drive day to day?

 

[NickD]

405 is a wild cam. How does the car drive day to day?

If I didn't know any different, I would say it drives exactly as it did before. There is no lack of flexibility. I notice exactly what it shows in the torque curve. There is noticeably stronger pick-up at 3K then you feel the slight lack of urgency as it gets to 4K. At 5K though it picks up its skirts and is off. That is the noticeable bit, that there is an increasing rush to the red line which previously wasn't there before making it no longer epically sluggish!

There is a small issue that we are trying to understand at the moment which is a hesitancy that can occur between 2.5k and 3k but is somewhat random and can be seen and heard in these videos

 

[rSilva]

Can't that dip in the torque be smoothed out with the mapping of the VVT? Or that went away with the follower and lifter kit?

 

[Onrus]

Please keep us updated. Cams are very interesting to me. I hope you sort the issue out

 

[NickD]

Can't that dip in the torque be smoothed out with the mapping of the VVT? Or that went away with the follower and lifter kit?

‍

Not a clue.

 

[NickD]

So the Clio of Epic Sluggishness becomes the Clio of Epic Noise! Shades of a BDA!

 

[NickD]

So as quick little update. I wrote elsewhere about the handling on the road and that I was finding it somewhat perturbing as if the suspension could no longer cope. Last Thursday we were at Snetterton and I have to say it now makes far more sense. I have always wanted this car to remain drivable on the road as the car I drive to and from work in, so I am not after the ultimate track machine, so I think I am happy where I am now.
Daily, it runs on 225 45 17 Kumho PS71 road tyres. These are never the star of any test reviews, but they are a perfectly decent road tyre giving good all round performance. However, they seem part of the problem on the road. Not that it says Kumho on them, but that road tyres, are too soft for the chassis. So going into a corner at decent speed means the tyre becomes more part of the suspension than is ideal. I would describe it as as the car reacts leaving the movement in the tyre to catch up. So instantly on fitting the ZTR tyres it felt different and more "true" in what it was doing.
So to track. As I was running the day, it does not give a lot of time for playing about. So with a "new" and at that time unknown track experience to come, as well as the ever present fear of "don't cause a red flag on your own day! I went out cautiously. I thought it wise to leave the stability control on to start with. That lasted a lap! What a amazing car. Yes it is loud, yes it has faults, but the grip and composure! I think I did 5 laps first off, because I have to give some tuition, but there was obviously so much left. Way too slow through Richies, braking too early for most corners and then the gear change is slow. I don't think I found the limit through Coram. Maybe the back could do with a little more rotation, but to be fair, I didn't think it suffered from any issues. A quick check of the video above suggests a 2:21 lap, which for a road car that goes to Tesco's for the shopping, is not bad and I know there is more there.
What was serious impressive was the way it just hung on with out a feeling of impending doom.
The brakes worked well all the time. I did experience some pad knock off which I initially though, "OK, here comes the fade" but it was down to the curbs rattling them back and a safety tap on the pedal with the left foot brings them all back in line. The biggest thing however was as the temps rose the gear change became much more difficult. If you watch the lap above, it sound far more like a historic muscle car and having to guide the gear into place rather than a nice positive change, so a bit like clutch drag. When it all cooled down again it was back to normal. So I don't know if it is air in the clutch line. Anyone else had a similar issue?
When I put the road wheels back on, after getting home, they made much more sense too. You just drive it differently that is all.

 

[suj]

I agree with you Nick, as I got "non-XL" Eagle F1s before and they made the ride crap, I thought it was suspension, but then I borrowed a friend's set of wheels, same everything just XL and 94 load rating not 91, it literally made the car so much better! So I waited for mine to wear out and fronts were changed to same and it's already so much better, I will be doing same for the rears.

I did it as my old E38 740iL had XL tyres and it drove so bad, so switching to non-XLs made a massive difference, but on the 197 it had such the opposite effect!

 

[NickD]

Cause of the miss fire / hesitancy resolved. There appeared to be some random latency that was happening at moderate throttle, or in reality pressure. However a replacement sensor and all sorted. Thank you Engine Dynamics.