Difficult new Suspension Choice

[RS13]

My Clio 200 is in need of some suspension love as the top mounts need to be replaced. After 160.000 kilometers, it seems wise to replace the rest of the suspension as well in order to go for the next 100.000 kilometers without issues.

My clio is an early 200 with the large top mounts and the standard suspension i.e. the pink shocks, blue/green front springs and orange/orange back springs.

I like the comfort of this set up and the directness on smaller b-roads but it lacks some stability with high speed corners.

Thinking hard about a new suspension and going through the forum, I narrowed it down to the following three choices:

1 - Stay with the original setup but renew the parts.
pros: comfort and ride height so no need to worry about speed bumps, side walks en tram lined country roads.
cons: lack of high speed stability and ride height (aesthetics).

2 - Change the suspension parts to the 197 Cup setup i.e. blue/orange front springs, blue/orange back springs and orange shocks.
pros: hopefully improve stability, 7 mm lower so looks better but high enough not to worry.
cons: loss of comfort compared to my current standard setup.

3 - Go all out (why not [emoji6]) with KW V3 Coilovers
pros: hopefully find the perfect compromise between comfort and stability using the outbound/compression adjustment possibilities with the V3.
cons: lowering by minimum 20/25mm which looks great but have to be more careful.

Concluding, I am looking for the best possible compromise for comfortable daily commuting, spirited drives on B-roads and fast flowing roads as well as the German Autobahn.

Is then the KW V3 Coilover set the best choice or just stay with the Renault suspensions? Choices, choices, choices[emoji3061].

I would really appreciate to read your thoughts and experiences for the above three options in order to help me finally make a decision.

Thanks in advance!


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[bedoef]

So I have two experiences I can share here that might help: I have a late 200 with KW Clubsports and topmounts (2-way adjustable dampers with height adjustment), and a Honda S2000 running HR Street setup (fixed Bilstein monotube dampers and height adjustable H&R springs).

Before I got the KWs, I ran OEM on street and track for 4 years. I enjoyed them on the street but they were rubbish on track. What I came to learn after installing the KWs was they really promoted understeer and generally limited the fun you can have with the car. And they were a bit harsh even for a stock setup - they didnt absorb abrupt bumps that well.

The biggest issue with these adjustable setups is that because you will have 2-way dampening adjustment you really need to understand how each variable impacts how the car behaves and where. Personally, when I first took delivery of the car with the new coilovers and solid topmounts installed, I thought the car was too springy with the factory KW settings. Eventually I gave up trying to find a good street setup and I just leave the car in track setup because thats more suited to how I use the car, and I accept the compromise whenever I DD the car (that said, where I live we have very good roads with no potholes so its way less of a headache than say New York roads). Around town, when I hit cats eyes, or raised lane dividers, or other such road imperfections, you definitly feel it in the car. The comfort impact I feel the most is actually due to the stiffer springs, the car really responds to the road level more - you notice imperfectly paved roads because the car is no longer floating over the waved pavement, but going up and down each wave. Gets frustrating after a long while for sure. I also have a big height drop on the car as well, and to be honest the KWs are so good I dont bottom out ever.

The Honda on the other hand, is a nice road compromise. Its lower and a little stiffer than stock, but also dampened very compliantly. It absorbs bumps much better than the clio without feeding back into the chassis. Its a nice set and forget setup that was built for the car and I just drive with. Between the 2 its a way better street setup that I enjoy every time I drive it.

One of the roads I drive on has a slightly raised manhole I enjoy hitting with the driver's side wheel everytime I pass in both cars, just to feel the difference. In the Clio, she tilts over because its setup more stiff on bump, so the hit is translated into chassis movement. In the Honda, its a postive contact - she soaks up the bump without upsetting the chassis. Feels more in control and compliant at the same time.

If you are aiming for a street setup only, I would suggest avoiding anything with more than a height adjustable setup. They are way too complicated to dial in and require servicing every so often. Look for a good coilover combo to improve the car's handling, coupled with adjustable topmounts to get more camber up front and really transform the way she can handle B roads. Running -1.5 degrees or more up front + good tires + good coilovers = way more fun on twisty roads!

TLDR: read it anyways, sorry for the novel.

 

[RS13]

No need to say sorry, I love a good novel [emoji6]. Thanks!


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[Sean197]

If you're not going on track then the KWs are overkill imo, if I were you I'd look at Bilstein B14s. With the b14s you'll get the height adjustment and the increased performance whilst still being compliant enough for daily road use. Mine were great on the road but too soft for the track.
Otherwise you could look at something like eibach springs and new cup shocks, but i personally have no experience running those.

 

[Abdulla Ali Al Ali]

For daily / fast road:
B14 (or any other equivalent monotube with height adjustment) + front lower arm adjustable bush ( for some rooms for camber if required)

For daily / fast road / occasional track:
similar to above + camber top plate (e.g. compbrake for early Clio, PMS) to dial in more camber. Some suspension brands do come with adjustable top mount

For Track:
B16 (or any other equivalent with minimum of 2-way adjustability) + front lower arm adjustable bush + adjustable top mount + rear shims

P.S. I'm using Bilstein B14 & B16 so that's why I mention them at my reply. Though they are other superior suspension brands that you can go for.

 

[Dannycowley]

If you’re. It tracking it don’t bother with coilovers, they will be too firm for you. The best road setup is Eibach springs on cup or standard dampers, mine ride much better on these than cup springs and improved handling too. I’m on Bilstein coilovers and while they can carry more speed through corners on track I think the Eibachs were a much better road option

 

[Wozzer]

I have a standard 200 that I predominantly drive ion B roads very rarely am on track and I’m not going to faff around with ride height. Wanted a setup that was compliant but with control. Therefore, went for Eiback Pro Springs, Koni Sports yellow dampers set at 1.0 Front and 1.5 Rear which aids rotation. I’ve also had it polybushed (Powerflex fast road). Car feels taught, controlled whilst compliant on the bumps.

 

[NickD]

I have some 200 cup suspension if you are interested. The fronts, including spring and top mounts were on the car about 6 months, if that and the rears are springs only, so you would need dampers.

 

[RS13]

I have some 200 cup suspension if you are interested. The fronts, including spring and top mounts were on the car about 6 months, if that and the rears are springs only, so you would need dampers. View attachment 152808View attachment 152808

Hi Nick, thank you for your offer but I still didn’t make a choice till now. I already purchased new OEM top mounts as I definitely don’t want to go for other (solid) mounts which could translate road vibrations etc. into the chassis. Same way I am not a fan of after market busing for engine mounts and suspension.

Can I ask you though, with what did you replace your cup suspension?


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[NickD]

Bilstien B14 and adjustable top mounts. Makes cup suspension feel less brutal!

 

[RS13]

Thanks for all the replies and feedback! It didn’t make my choice more easy though[emoji3].

Adding to the the list of choices seems to be the B14’s.

Am I correct to understand that the B14 suspension is the compromise I am looking for: more comfortable than a cup setup but still more stable and compliant?


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[wootwoot]

Thanks for all the replies and feedback! It didn’t make my choice more easy though[emoji3].

Adding to the the list of choices seems to be the B14’s.

Am I correct to understand that the B14 suspension is the compromise I am looking for: more comfortable than a cup setup but still more stable and compliant?


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If you go with the B14s make sure you trim the rear bump stop about 1.5cm
The car will sit almost on the rear bump stop at max rise hight on the adjuster.

 

[NickD]

Although I have solid top mounts, which standard suspension does not, I would be hard pushed to say it is more refined than standard cup suspension.