Brake pedal "feel" ?

[sevenfourate]

I've reads threads on here about the ABS system on these cars affecting pedal "feel".....and obviously seen the ABS delete kits for sale: which i presume amongst other things is to help firm up the pedal therefore ?

This leads me to my car:

When i bought it - it had just had brand new rear discs and pads. I had ALL the calipers serviced, new pins fitted and everything lubed up. I also had all the fluid taken out and refreshed with new before being re-bled. Even after all that pedal feel wasnt as firm as i'd have liked, although very good indeed and a huge-huge improvement over before.

Not sure whether its me or not - but this sloppiness in the pedal MAY have increased in the 4 months ive driven the car since.

Both sets of pads have plenty of meat on them (Like more than 2/3rds). Pistons retracting fine - i have no binding. And i certainly have no leak at any nipples, master cylinder etc. The brakes once "engaged" are fantastic.


BUT - i have probably nearly a full inch of travel on the pedal before anything much happens. Whilst you would get no feel at all from a rock-hard pedal - im just wondering if some play / movement / travel is normal in these cars - even when the system is in "perfect" or even very-good condition as such ?

 

[Kazumz]

I've reads threads on here about the ABS system on these cars affecting pedal "feel".....and obviously seen the ABS delete kits for sale: which i presume amongst other things is to help firm up the pedal therefore ?

This leads me to my car:

When i bought it - it had just had brand new rear discs and pads. I had ALL the calipers serviced, new pins fitted and everything lubed up. I also had all the fluid taken out and refreshed with new before being re-bled. Even after all that pedal feel wasnt as firm as i'd have liked, although very good indeed and a huge-huge improvement over before.

Not sure whether its me or not - but this sloppiness in the pedal MAY have increased in the 4 months ive driven the car since.

Both sets of pads have plenty of meat on them (Like more than 2/3rds). Pistons retracting fine - i have no binding. And i certainly have no leak at any nipples, master cylinder etc. The brakes once "engaged" are fantastic.


BUT - i have probably nearly a full inch of travel on the pedal before anything much happens. Whilst you would get no feel at all from a rock-hard pedal - im just wondering if some play / movement / travel is normal in these cars - even when the system is in "perfect" or even very-good condition as such ?

If I push the pedal down an inch, it rips my face off.

My girlfriend can't drive it, she hits the brakes way too hard and can't get used to it.

An inch, even so, isn't bad!

 

[sevenfourate]

If I push the pedal down an inch, it rips my face off.

My girlfriend can't drive it, she hits the brakes way too hard and can't get used to it.

An inch, even so, isn't bad!

Interesting.



As far as im aware, my system is; and should be in really good order.

It can only really possibly be - the fact it wasn't bled "the best way it could have been".

As it wasnt firm before, and although 'firmer'; isnt as i'd like - or by the sound of it like yours either.

 

[DS197]

If I push the pedal down an inch, it rips my face off.

My girlfriend can't drive it, she hits the brakes way too hard and can't get used to it.

An inch, even so, isn't bad!

I wish my brakes were that good! I have the same issue in where there is a bit of pedal travel during which no braking takes place. I've put it down to the calipers needing a refurb as the car has had new pads, discs, brake fluid and the calipers have been stripped and cleaned.

 

[Kazumz]

I wish my brakes were that good! I have the same issue in where there is a bit of pedal travel during which no braking takes place. I've put it down to the calipers needing a refurb as the car has had new pads, discs, brake fluid and the calipers have been stripped and cleaned.

Could just be worn parts that's all, I'd go about getting new and bigger brakes if I was in the same boat as you guys. Perhaps that will help.

 

[DS197]

Could just be worn parts that's all, I'd go about getting new and bigger brakes if I was in the same boat as you guys. Perhaps that will help.

The plans to get Megane 265 brembos and 343mm discs, but need to do a few track days so I can wear down the news ones i've just put on the car! The calipers are almost 10 years old though so could do with a refurb. I'm fairly certain that would solve the issue.

 

[sevenfourate]

I wish my brakes were that good! I have the same issue in where there is a bit of pedal travel during which no braking takes place. I've put it down to the calipers needing a refurb as the car has had new pads, discs, brake fluid and the calipers have been stripped and cleaned.

Not sure if its the same and applies with Clio's / cars in general; but on off-road bikes with poor brakes (Im talking pretty modern KTM's, Suzuki RM's etc) if i renewed a braking system over a few weeks [Discs, pads, braided lines etc] the biggest single change i ever got on ALL the bikes was from fitting a Master-Cylinder rebuild kit. Did this to perhaps five: 4 or 5 year old bikes in recent times.

Always improved braking, lessened lever travel and firmed up feel 200%. MUCH bigger improvement than new pads / discs or a simple bleeding.

Just saying........(?)

 

[sevenfourate]

^^^^

And im talking about fitting bigger Wavy discs, uprated sintered pads, and quality braided lines.

The difference a Master Cylinder rebuild made was bigger than everything else combined just about..........

 

[DS197]

Not sure if its the same and applies with Clio's / cars in general; but on off-road bikes with poor brakes (Im talking pretty modern KTM's, Suzuki RM's etc) if i renewed a braking system over a few weeks [Discs, pads, braided lines etc] the biggest single change i ever got on ALL the bikes was from fitting a Master-Cylinder rebuild kit. Did this to perhaps five: 4 or 5 year old bikes in recent times.

Always improved braking, lessened lever travel and firmed up feel 200%. MUCH bigger improvement than new pads / discs or a simple bleeding.

Just saying........(?)

I have the feeling that it may be unnecessary on Clios, however one thing you've mentioned is braided brake lines, I imagine the old rubber brake lines would be worth replacing with the braided variety.

 

[Johnny 99]

one thing you've mentioned is braided brake lines, I imagine the old rubber brake lines would be worth replacing with the braided variety.

I hope so as I am about to get braided brake lines fitted next Monday along with ds2500 pads & Brembo HC front discs.

 

[DS197]

I hope so as I am about to get braided brake lines fitted next Monday along with ds2500 pads & Brembo HC front discs.

Let us know how you get on mate

 

[Johnny 99]

Let us know how you get on mate

Will do.

 

[Pav]

Don't expect too much of a diff with new braided lines..they may prove their worth at a track day though..still better to have them..my breaks are good I think but there is some travel before a proper bite..

 

[Johnny 99]

Don't expect too much of a diff with new braided lines..they may prove their worth at a track day though..still better to have them..my breaks are good I think but there is some travel before a proper bite..

I'm doing this specifically for track days whilst still keeping the car usable on the road so hopefully this set up will achieve this. It's certainly what has been suggested after asking for opinions/advice on the forum. Maybe a little travel is better than a wooden feeling pedal?

 

[RossWoods93]

I always feel like theres more play in the brake pedal on my Clio compared other cars...
If I hope into a company car VW Passatt for the day, first time I hit the brakes it'll literally throw me at the windowscreen (being used to firmer pressure needed in the Clio!) I then hop back into the Clio at the end of the day and find that I'm too sensitive on the brake, and more pressure needed! Might be different for other people mind, I've been running the same discs/pads as standard for the last year or so with the odd servicing!

 

[Jimmy]

Yeah I've noticed a very small bit of dead travel, especially at low speeds (i.e. in traffic). When you're pushing on a bit though, I find they're just right.

I've got used to it in the time I've had the car, however when my brother drives it, he puts us through the windscreen the first time he brakes... Just something the 197/200 'has'?

 

[Foxspeed]

all you can do is check the obvious and make sure the master cylinder is fully returned and system bleed correctly and things like handbrake lever arms are fully back when handbrake off and nothing binding

make sure the servo works correctly

and if possible compare to another car

 

[sevenfourate]

At least it seems im not alone, and this is somewhat of a Clio trait..........

Gonna get the oil changed and get them to have a look at the stoppers and maybe bleed again.

 

[Jim_]

@sevenfourate Did you ever get to the bottom of your brake pedal conundrum?

 

[sevenfourate]

@sevenfourate Did you ever get to the bottom of your brake pedal conundrum?

I had them bled again - and we think there was still a small bit of air somewhere.

This helped loads.

And pedal feel (Firmness / amount of travel) also improved enormously once i'd fitted the Ferodo 2500 front and Mintex M1144 rears.

I can understand brakes performing better....less fade etc....with the uprated pads. But IMO pedal travel did too !