197/200 Cambelt Differences...

[Willis]

Bonjour!!!

Just doing some reading and was wondering if anybody knows why the 197 is 5Yrs for the Cambelt but the 200 is 6Yrs?

Surely the engines and service parts are 99.99% identical!?!

Cheers,

Will

 

[Foxspeed]

ha ha!

someone else picked up on this one!!!

i asked the question and the parts are the same!

to be honest have you heard of a belt fail on a 197? i havent!!!

the miles are more critical than time

 

[Matthew197]

Very true ! I've not heard of a failed belt on a 197. Hoping I'm not the first as mine is due a change :/

 

[Willis]

Nope can't say I've read or heard of any failures either!

Much like Matthew, I don't want to be the first hahaha!

Nicole is booked in at Birchdown for the end of June (officially she was five on 12 May 12) but money is a little tight at the moment after moving jobs so I'm wondering wether to "risk" moving it back until my next lot of time off which will be October. I don't want to p!ss the lads up there around too much though as I've already had to move the date once because of not being able to get time off work...

I'll see how the money goes this month and then decide I think. The thing is, if I move this from June then I will more than likely be able to attend the RS trackday at Oulton Park in August and not have to sell my voucher.

Hmmm, what to do...

 

[Ash]

I was thinking this too. Mines due soon but its only done 48k and the service schedule say 5yrs or 70k. I might leave it till the end of the year as like Foxspeed said, I would have thought the miles would be more critical than the age.

 

[Digital Reaper]

Got mine done within the recommended time limit as it was approaching the 5 year mark on 39k - got the waterpump replaced at the same time - £720 at Renault.

I'd rather not take the risk tbh.

Just my 2p.

Anthony.

 

[Willis]

I agree fully Anthony, I would usually always go off whichever came first.

But in this instance, I can't see how Renault have stuck another year on if everything is identical. Maybe they were being over cautious with the 197?

 

[MarkCup]

There's been a flood of failed cambelts over on cliosport.net recently.

My understanding is time is just as critical as mileage...and as the 197/200 engines are essentially the same as 172/182s, I'd always exercise caution and if anything go for a change earlier than recommended.

 

[Willis]

Are the failures on 1*2s or on the 197/200s as well Mark? The 182s are at newest 7 years old now.

I completely agree on the whatever comes first Yrs/Mileage thing. Renault have moved the goalposts though which is what I'm trying to get at.

Surely, the belts and tensioners are good for either 5Yrs or for 6Yrs... They can't use the same parts, with the same tension, on 99.99% the same engine and then suddenly decide that an extra year is ok without there being some reason for it? If the parts are only good for 5Yrs then there's (potentially) going to be a lot of Clio 200 owners driving around in a few years time sat on a timebomb...

 

[deadmau5]

Are the failures on 1*2s or on the 197/200s as well Mark? The 182s are at newest 7 years old now.

I completely agree on the whatever comes first Yrs/Mileage thing. Renault have moved the goalposts though which is what I'm trying to get at.

Surely, the belts and tensioners are good for either 5Yrs or for 6Yrs... They can't use the same parts, with the same tension, on 99.99% the same engine and then suddenly decide that an extra year is ok without there being some reason for it? If the parts are only good for 5Yrs then there's (potentially) going to be a lot of Clio 200 owners driving around in a few years time sat on a timebomb...

If there are a load of failures on the 200, I'm sure Renault will acknowledge there's a problem, just like they did with the 197 gearbox

 

[cockers]

The 172/182 engines have a diiferent timing set up , and the timing belt does not run the water pump.
The 197 / 200 does use the same timing belt kits , but they run the water pump, so this acts as one of the idlers for the timing belt.
The 197/200 do not suffer from as common failure as the 172/182 , but i have seen it (3) and heard of it.
Its never normally the actual belt that fails , usally the tensioner / idler / water pump bearing , and my advice to anyone would be to have the belt kit and waterpump changed at the recommended interval ,using genuine parts for correct fitment and the warranty , and i am not sure as to why they have the interval , but will try to find out.

 

[Willis]

Nice one Cockers!!!

Yeah if you wouldn't mind asking and if you find a reason then please let us know.

 

[MicKPM]

Same timing belt kit, same water pump, same engine. Renault playing silly games to attract fleet managers I guess. Alfa did this with the 147/156 and had tensioners fail at 35k so they soon back tracked on there claims of 5yrs/72k.

Timing belt intervals aren't black and white unfortunatly and for the cost of a change vs cost to rebuild the top end if it fails makes it a no brainier. We do them for 197.net members for a mere £430 with genuine belt kits, fixings, w.pump and type-d so it's not a terrible bill really.

Mick

 

[BenW]

Whilst the engine is 99% the same there could be some changes to ancillaries like the PAS pump causing the belt to see lower peak loads which in turn is going to mean reduced wear.

Just get it changed at 5 years, if you don't you just take the risk of it going and potentially reduce the value of your car after someone sees such an important service delayed.

 

[MicKPM]

It doesn't run a PAS pump, it's EPAS

 

[BenW]

Was just an example, ABS pump or air con compressor would have fitted in that sentence equally!

 

[MicKPM]

Belt driven ABS? Granted Ben but i assure you, there is no difference between the timing belt runs on the 197 & 200 as Renaults of new are all very modular to keep costs down... The ancillary platforms deployed are shared across the ranges now. The Clio III RS uses the same run as the Megane RS and all other models that run the F4R unit such as the Laguna III or Scenic III. I personally wouldn't trust an F4R with a timing belt driven water pump for 6 years. I've seen a fair few of them leak at around the 4 year mark from the main bearing seal.

Mick

 

[sideways danny]

I still advise anyone with a 200 to use 197 service intervals

 

[MicKPM]

Too right Danny it's just not worth the risk.

I see a lot of Lagunas and I still get strange looks from owners when I tell them to ignore the 18k service clock intervals and half it in order to save their turbos. Some understand it but most go by the clock because Renault have never made a mistake before have they?

 

[BenW]

Belt driven ABS? Granted Ben but i assure you, there is no difference between the timing belt runs on the 197 & 200 as Renaults of new are all very modular to keep costs down... The ancillary platforms deployed are shared across the ranges now. The Clio III RS uses the same run as the Megane RS and all other models that run the F4R unit such as the Laguna III or Scenic III. I personally wouldn't trust an F4R with a timing belt driven water pump for 6 years. I've seen a fair few of them leak at around the 4 year mark from the main bearing seal.

Mick

Never said anything about the runs being different, just possible that the ancillaries are different. I work on diesel fuel pump development which is normally belt driven and there are a huge number of variants out there, even on the same engine. This is normally due to changes after start of production to keep manufacturing costs down, these costs are then partly passed on to the customer. For example, if we were to change the geometry in the pumps this can significantly affect the loads transmitted to the belt. We're talking auxiliary belt in this case but even so those loads can be passed on to the cambelt.

All I wanted to say was there could have been some development somewhere which has reduced loading on the cambelt and allowed longer service intervals. The end customer isn't going to see any difference in the components, just a small change in part numbers.