Genuine New Clio 197 Rack will not line up can anyone help?

[turkie172]

Got a new genuine Clio 197 rack and installed it last night steering wheel was kept at dead centre and the new rack was centred up but the universal joint cant connect as it is a little out of alignment. The new standard rack is 2 3/4 turns lock to lock the exact same as the old one. Basically the steering wheel is 45 degrees to the right when connected and I'm getting 2 1/4 turns left to full lock and 2 1/2 turns right to full lock I checked everything I cant see any way of compensating for the alignment Issue the Renault clip says the steering wheel was in the zero angle position but the rack would not line up for connection. Went to get the alignment done this morning and the little dude could not do it he said the right outer track road was stuck but he had turned it so far that it was bottomed out so have no faith that the guy knew what he was doing.
The only thing I can do is give the rack a full turn but I think it is too much correction then index the steering wheel a third of a turn to compensate then finish centring the wheel with the track rod ends.
Could I have been given a wrongly assembled rack or is there something I am missing from what I see there is an pacific angle the shaft should sit at when the rack is centered to allow connection to the universal joint on the steering column and the column has no adjustment angle wise.

 

[RSRowe]

It's funny you should have this issue. I've had all my subframe off recently, tracked it up and one track rod was all the way in and the other all the way out.
I centred them up which meant the wheel was around 45 degrees out.

Rightly or wrongly, I just undid my wheel centre bolt and centred it along with the clock spring. Seems to work ok so far

 

[turkie172]

I was going to check this tomorrow I centered the rack today and got the tracking done but because the wheel is 45 degrees to the right now I'm getting the "Check ESP" warning along with the spanner so I was going to take the Steering wheel off and remove the clock spring to physically centre it again and was hoping to centre the steering wheel but looking at the old standard steering wheel there are three key grooves in it, so can you tell me that the standard steering wheel can be refitted at a different angle to make it level again.

 

[turkie172]

steering wheel close up

 

[turkie172]

Right looked at the angle sensor and the splines the steering wheel is not adjustable angle wise nor is the clock spring as the wires go through the window in the back of the steering wheel so it has to move with the steering wheel. My only chance is to reprogram the angle sensor to knock the ESP light off to get it through MOT with a cock eyed steering wheel. Anyone had any experience dealing with new Renault parts that are made wrong how they deal with it and how long it takes.

 

[RSRowe]

I see what you mean, I've got an aftermarket wheel..... Though that shouldn't make any difference.

I also have an intermittent esp fault (no error codes on clip) But I had that before I messed with the wheel

 

[turkie172]

Well I got the steering angle sensor zeroed with the Renault clip that I have and that has cleared the error lights etc the steering wheel is at 45 degrees to the right but what can I do. I'm going to see if I can get a MOT cancelation slot tomorrow and a trip to the Renault dealership to see what needs to be done about the steering rack. If you guys are unaware the MOT system in N.Ireland is in a big pile of S**T at the moment all the government test centres have had the lifts condemned due to cracking of the uprights so there is a 1 - 2 month wait for a test date.
BBC News article

 

[RSRowe]

I did wonder if maybe the racks are actually meant to be offset on them standard......
Doesn't seem right though.

 

[Foxspeed]

Well I got the steering angle sensor zeroed with the Renault clip that I have and that has cleared the error lights etc the steering wheel is at 45 degrees to the right but what can I do. I'm going to see if I can get a MOT cancelation slot tomorrow and a trip to the Renault dealership to see what needs to be done about the steering rack. If you guys are unaware the MOT system in N.Ireland is in a big pile of S**T at the moment all the government test centres have had the lifts condemned due to cracking of the uprights so there is a 1 - 2 month wait for a test date.
BBC News article

yeh thats a right cock up them buying all the same lifts!!!

 

[turkie172]

I went to the dealers today the guys are absolutely OK and are going to order another rack and check it against my used one to see if the alignment of the pinion shaft is OK, I showed the head mechanic what all I have had to do. The rack cant be offset if you keep the steering wheel centred and try to adjust the track rods which I have shown you can't as you run out of adjustment and if you could you will find you can turn the steering more to the right than the left. Good news on the MOT many phone calls to different numbers and being cut off I when to the test centre and they told me I have an exception note until June and don't need an MOT until then and I don't have to turn up for the appointment on the 27th and if I had known I would have all this bother I would have done no work to the car until then. The mechanic said something about the phase 2 having an adjustable (splined) intermediate shaft that would have allowed adjustment, now I don't know if he was referring to the Clio II or the face lift model of the 197 but I will keep you updated.

 

[RSRowe]

Some good news then. Cheers Turkie

 

[turkie172]

Right just an update Renault booked me in at the local Dealer and I was there for 4hrs today I guess to double check everything after ordering another 2 genuine steering racks and they were the same as the one I fitted. The result is after Renault tech centre were contacted and we waited an hour for a response it turns out that the Renault Dialogys both the old system and the new one are giving the wrong part number and the correct part number is 490018853R standard 197 rack. The other bit of news is that its cheaper than what I paid and we went out and check a Mk3 Clio outside and its rack was 2 3/4 turns lock to lock so the 197 rack is the same as any mk3 Clio rack and its just the track rod assemblies that make it unique for a 197.
I'll let you all know if it works out when the rack is delivered I'm just not looking forward to taking the sub frame off again.

 

[turkie172]

Just got a phone call from the Dealer today the new rack was in and about an hour later they rang back it's the same problem as the other racks they have been comparing everything to my old rack basically if my old rack was full left then the new rack should go to the same position for the universal joint connection but it's not its still about 45Degrees to the right they are ringing Renault today

 

[RSRowe]

I'm starting to think they're all like this

 

[turkie172]

I cant understand why they don't sell a bare standard rack it would do all Mk3 Clio's and I will put the track rods on it. I am so glad I did not buy this online otherwise I would be in the poo with postage back and forth.

 

[turkie172]

Right nothing from Renault and with the lockdown continuing and getting more frustrated I took action to correct the problem until Renault fix the problem and replace the rack. I went last week to the breaking yard they let me in alone and I pulled the intermediate steering shaft from a Clio you can see the splines are plastic and the other half has pinched ends to stop you pulling them apart so being very careful I heated the pinched end making sure the heat did not travel up the parts and pulled them apart centred the steering wheel and with heat to expand the outer shaft put them together again there is 18 splines so worked out each index was 20 Degrees. The wheel may now be a little off centre but tracking adjustment should now be fit to correct it, I'll recalibrate the steering angle sensor back to stop the ESP warnings again and now I can get MOT if they ever open again I already had an exception since 20th Feb. until June already. I'm not happy modifying such a part but I feel it's the lesser of the two problems.



You can see the difference now I had some tape on the wheel to remind me where the centre was.

 

[RSRowe]

Thought I’d update this. Recalibrated my clock spring yesterday with clip.
Haven’t had any faults since - so it’s looking promising!

 

[turkie172]

When did you fit your rack was it new and is it a standard rack or the faster cup rack? as mine was a standard rack.

 

[RSRowe]

Mines my original standard rack. Never been replaced to my knowledge.

I asked my old man to sort the tracking on it after I’d replaced the gearbox on it. He noticed that one end was all the way in, and the other all the way out - exactly the same as yours.

 

[turkie172]

Well we have come to the end of the road with the rack 8 brand new racks ordered with different part numbers some suggested by the Renault Tech center none matched up we did get a standard Clio rack it lined up OK and had the same number of turns lock to lock but the body of the rack was shorter so if the 197 track rod ends were fitted they might not reach the hub assembly so that went back as well.
Renault suggested taking the steering shaft collapsing it and index it on the splines but I told them and showed them you could not do that without damaging the splines or forcing the shaft apart which was what I had to do anyway but it was a safety device and I was not comfortable doing that especially if the car was sold on and someone got hurt in an accident.



I cant believe that Renault UK can't product a standard steering rack that fits a normal 197 and only for my local dealer parts man who has made an arrangement with me for a certain total amount of discount on new parts as their personal fix. I just can believe that I paid full price for a Genuine steering rack let the dealer take 4hrs + 8 months to confirm everything to Renault Tech center for no advantage and that I had then to go and get a steering shaft to modify that in order to cover Renaults wrongly made steering rack so it was usable and would pass MOT.
If anyone is able to acquire a new Genuine non cup steering rack that works let me know please.